[quote=Web Monkey]4 Police officers injured? One member of th public. Your pathetic.[/quote]
Let us think about 9-11 and the London bombings...? That was a form of protest by Muslim extremists. Now that involved the loss of lives...So I would like to think that a protest held against that kind of extremism would be welcomed?
I say, the words " Your Pathetic" should of been thought a little longer about, before posting?
PS... Please don't ' counter post ' about foreign government policy with Afghanistan and Iraq.
The differenve is that 9-11 and the London bombings were an act of terrorism not a protest.
Everyone has the right to PEACEFULL PROTEST.
I can not condone people pelting the police with bricks, bottles, coins etc and lets face it the EDF will not win public support by doing so. They could argue that they did not do it themselves and that others that joined the march did but racist thugs will join the EDF ranks because that is what they promote.
The muslim religon is a peacfull one but just like all groups it has its extreamists. Do not forget the Christians with the Crusades or the Catholic church during the Spanish Inquisition.
Submitted by Web Monkey on Tue, 2010/01/26 - 10:16.
My first comments weren't about politics, forget that for one second.
My problem was with the first remark. "It was good to see that this went ok without any problems."
ah, you must be a friend of Web Monkey. Welcome sunshine, and I really can't be bothered to explain irony if you don't have the ability to see it yourself.
[quote=Dungwit]ah, you must be a friend of Web Monkey. Welcome sunshine, and I really can't be bothered to explain irony if you don't have the ability to see it yourself.[/quote]
This is a community website In would like to think that we are all friends. However your posts are not in keeping with this type of site. Perhaps they would be more suitable else where.
Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.
[quote=Dungwit]Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.[/quote]
I will explain as you seem only to be able to understand yourself. You started with a post that could be taken in more than one way. When WM challanged it you set about him with personal abuse (not funny) Then you assume that your posts would not be allowed incorrectly,
We are a democracy everyone has a right to free speech. Last how can I know if I am not happy with your posts if I do not read them.
Perhaps the clue to your personality is in your name , in which case perhaps an 02 thief tag may be appropriate.
[quote=Steve][quote=Dungwit]Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.[/quote]
I will explain as you seem only to be able to understand yourself. You started with a post that could be taken in more than one way. When WM challanged it you set about him with personal abuse (not funny) Then you assume that your posts would not be allowed incorrectly,
We are a democracy everyone has a right to free speech. Last how can I know if I am not happy with your posts if I do not read them.
Perhaps the clue to your personality is in your name , in which case perhaps an 02 thief tag may be appropriate.[/quote]
Gee thanks for explaining, but you as you say yourself, the original post could be taken in more ways than one and was designed to open up dialogue. However, WM seemed to take it in the way that he wanted to, ie, negatively, and he set about me with personal abuse. (Please read his initial "Moron" comment, or did it not fit your agenda to notice that remark?)
If you want to stoop to personal abuse yourself (02 thief tag?), then maybe it's you who should find another forum to post on. So run along little man and get the pat on the head that you crave from your WM friend.
Anyway, how did you feel the protest march went. You never did say. (Perhaps you need time to ask WM what your thoughts are on this matter.
Protesting about muslim extreamists is pointless. As it is the sort of reaction the extreamists want as it just stirs up more hatered and predudice. But the EDF are extreamists themselves.
However the goverment have not helped the situation by allowing immigration at such a large scale.
I am not a racist but I do belive that we have now been to soft with immigration.
[quote=Steve]Protesting about muslim extreamists is pointless. As it is the sort of reaction the extreamists want as it just stirs up more hatered and predudice. But the EDF are extreamists themselves.
However the goverment have not helped the situation by allowing immigration at such a large scale.
I am not a racist but I do belive that we have now been to soft with immigration.[/quote]
Well if there are no protests, how can the Government be made aware of the unrest of the population? How can we know that the EDL is an extremist group as we all know that the Government portray any group that disagree with their policies as extremist or facist, or communist etc. The press will report them as such as it helps to sell newspapers and the Press moguls hols a vested interest in retaining the status quo.
I too am not a racist, but when a white working class man feels discriminated against in his own country, maybe it's time to voice our concerns to those that run this country.
Consider how the Government have ensured that business' set up employment law to ensure that there is a quota of ethnic minorities when selecting staff, regardless of qualification and thereby exempting white workers, consider how the police treat white protestors with batons and strong armed tactics and compare that with the kid glove treatment that protesting muslims get when storming the Dutch Embassy in London, and consider how the council virtually gifted council owned land to muslims to build a mosque when we have delapidated schools and hospitals in the City.
As a matter of interest, I wonder what the white/muslim ratio of employees make up the workforces in Muslim owned businesses.
Perhaps it's not unreasonable that these protests will become more and more commonplace, the people of Britain can only stand so much provocation.
It appears that you are looking to blame any non Anglo Saxon for the woes of this country. If I were you I would look no further than the government of Nu Lairbour. They really should have listened to Enoch Powell all those years ago. Any way take a look at these two links they seem pretty un biased.
[quote=Dungwit]It was good to see that this went ok without any problems.[/quote]
No Problems I think people including members of the public were hurt that I think is a problem don't you, you have the right to have your say we all do but do it the right way ok
No, I'm not looking to blame non Anglo Saxons for the woes of the country. I'm saying that due to lthe Governments policies for the last 30 years, we find ourselves in a position where the white Anglo Saxon population is frightened to speak out against what they feel is unacceptable in case they are labelled racist or deemed to have an intolerant attitude towards other faiths.
This is not the case in the overwhelming majority of cases, but Muslims in particular use these policies to advance their own agendas at the expense of others.
As far as mrhorace's comment is concerned, I'm at a loss to understand what he means. Is that even English?
I will agree with Steve and Web Monkey when they say that the first comment was a little out of place given that there were things that went wrong at the protest. However, I have to agree with Dungwit when it comes to how the general British population are being treated compared to minority groups. We must take into consideration that many of these people who we call foreigners are actually fully fledged British citizens, they were born here, educated here etc..
As mrhorace wrote "do it the right way", many people have tried this over the years but we have a government who think more of Europe than that of it's own people, that is of cause unless you are a Banker!!!!
Anyway, I think that if Dungwit would have wrote the reply to Steves comment, titled "Steve wrote:Protesting About" as his first comment things would have gone a lot better. Anyway, I will get off my soap box now.
Surely the simple answer is that in this country we need total equality and this government does not appear be giving us that. However, would any other potential leading party do a better job on this complex policy?
Within this area we live in a diverse cultural society and I have no problems talking to anyone, no matter what his/her colour or race. We need to stop further immigration at the rate it was happening at but also work with those people who live here already, that goes for everyone, Christian, Muslim, Jew, Hindu or other. If we fail to do so what kind of society are we going to leave for our children?
Submitted by Web Monkey on Sun, 2010/01/24 - 22:15.
What got my back up in dungtwits first post was his unironic glorifying of yesterdays march.
A march in which 4 officers and 1 member of the public were injured. Numerous business and residential homes and cars were damaged. 17 arrests made (am I right in thinking they were all edl?)
When challenged dw feigned moral outrage, pretending I'd got the wrong end of the stick, which the more he posted the more it became apparent I'd not.
Rich, maybe dw should ask you to run through his postings first, as you expressed and backed up your views. And like him believe the policy and levels of imigration are far to excessive. My view is our natural food and energy resources cannot meet this demand over the next few decades.
And don't be fooled if you think the march was against extremist Muslims. Why target normacot mosque? why try and break through to cobridge? Why hurl abuse at stokies.
As Steve said (I'm following you now Steve) head over to pitsnpots for the live reporting and summaries .
It's good that dw did post like he told me it promotes debate. There are two big elections coming up, local and national.
It's time for everyone to exercise their right to vote. But don't leave it to the polling both, to decide your politics. Time to read up.
I totally agree that injuries and damage to property is totally unacceptable. However, from the two articles linked within this topic it would seem that most of the trouble was caused by people not directly linked to the protest. These people should obviously be dealt with to the greatest extent that the law permits, this sort of behaviour should never be tolerated.
It is a shame that yet again a few people spoil it for the majority. I for one have no problem in anyone having peaceful demonstrations. However, as indicated in the articles, I am sure that the organisers of this event will now have to trouble convincing any other City to allow them to demonstrate.
[quote=Web Monkey]What got my back up in dungtwits first post was his unironic glorifying of yesterdays march.
A march in which 4 officers and 1 member of the public were injured. Numerous business and residential homes and cars were damaged. 17 arrests made (am I right in thinking they were all edl?)
When challenged dw feigned moral outrage, pretending I'd got the wrong end of the stick, which the more he posted the more it became apparent I'd not.
Rich, maybe dw should ask you to run through his postings first, as you expressed and backed up your views. And like him believe the policy and levels of imigration are far to excessive. My view is our natural food and energy resources cannot meet this demand over the next few decades.
And don't be fooled if you think the march was against extremist Muslims. Why target normacot mosque? why try and break through to cobridge? Why hurl abuse at stokies.
As Steve said (I'm following you now Steve) head over to pitsnpots for the live reporting and summaries .
It's good that dw did post like he told me it promotes debate. There are two big elections coming up, local and national.
It's time for everyone to exercise their right to vote. But don't leave it to the polling both, to decide your politics. Time to read up.
Horace - made sense to qme.[/quote]
Web Monkey, you never cease to amaze. Are you simple, gullible or naive? Maybe all three?
Firstly, I don't glorify the march at all. I have said that it's a sign of things to come if their isn't a major shift in the Governments policies. Not just immigration, but equality. It has been acknowledged by certain Government figures, that the white working class have been overlooked over a good number of years.
A question. Why was the UAF allowed to countermarch at the same venue? They could easily have protested on a nother day. Four officers injured? Two resumed their duties immediately, the other returned to duty after treatment and the last one treated for minor injuries. Whilst I agree, no one should have to be injured or hurt during these protests, it's pretty much a certainty that someone will be hurt particularly when two diagonally opposed groups are allowed to march at the same time.
Numerous cars and homes? Can you quantify that? Any damage is not acceptable, but you are making out it's like Dresden after the Blitz. (I mean the Dresden in Germany before you ask)
Now, if you had the inclination to think for yourself, instead of sponging up all the Newspaper and media soundbites, you might just come to a conclusion of your own. Think about it, go on, I know you can.
The press will report to sell newspapers. Sensationalism sells, simples. The Police, who exist to serve the Government, not the public, will have their agenda set by the Government. Therefore, it serves them well to portray any dissenting voices as rabble rousers, bigoted, racist etc. Maybe it was in their interest to let a countermarch go ahead in order to inflame the situation.
By the way, if you want to talk about bigoted views, have a look at the Muslim attitude to women, homosexuals, non believers, their own caste systems, forced marriages etc.
Submitted by Web Monkey on Tue, 2010/01/26 - 10:10.
First you start with a flippent remark, to get everyone but yourself talking (as you told me) about what they think.
Your right I didn't see what was going with my own eyes. I watched it unfold on twitter http://pitsnpots.co.uk/live
Read Pits n Pots, as they were following the day in real time. The Sentinel posted what was a summary of the Police press release at the end of the day, late on Saturday night, and was so poorly written, I couldn't form any opinion based on their report.
Keep watching: about 20 seconds in. So no, it wasn't a good day up hanley was it. EDL need to loose the hard core element before people even begin to listen to them, and not think of them as just thugs.
Before it all kicked off, this old couple went through the massed rally as though nothing was untoward. One video on You Tube showed the lack of respect from some youths as they went by.
I then formed my own opinion, and not one I'm told to form. I still have the right to think and express my views?
While your comment did not offend me Dungwit or antagonize me, i think that if it had been a little better presented i am sure (well i hope) you may not have caught such a fish......
Yes you do raise some valid points as well as web monkey does, maybe you are both closer in your views in reality than you both think......
WM, here's the point. The EDL march was a message to the Government. It is a shout from the bullied and browbeaten public that enough is enough. We all want an equal society but that means for EVERYBODY, including the white working class.
How can it be healthy to surpress geniune outrage at discrimination?
The real problem is that the country is now attacking the right to free speech. But right is right and wrong is wrong, and I see no reason for the EDL to have their views surpressed.
I used to work with a Pakistani colleague and during our discussions, he said that he would never have a white girlfriend as they have loose morals and dress inappropriately. I told him I thought he was being racist as not all white women were like this. He replied, "I can't be racist, I'm Asian". (This may give you a clue about what the Muslim community really think about us)
Now, if I said the same thing about a Muslim woman, I would automatically castigated as a racist, and rightly so.
The point is, the Government, police, civil service, council, all bend over backwards in order not to offend Muslims, but in doing so they discriminate against others. This is what the EDL, BNP etc are protesting about.
The other point I would like to close on is the difference in attitude shown by the police when dealing with the EDL faction and the counter protest march. Take a look at the video evidence. At the counter protest march the police couldn't have looked friendlier if they had dressed as telly tubbies. Contrast that with the greeting the police gave to the EDL.
Submitted by Web Monkey on Wed, 2010/01/27 - 00:14.
Dungwit, I only missed your point because you never stated it until just.
Can I just add, that out of all of this the best line of the thread has be awarded to you.
"At the counter protest march the police couldn't have looked friendlier if they had dressed as telly tubbies."
So there you have it. I think myself and Dungwit have gone on long enough about this, you've got enough view points now to start thinking about the elections later this year, and also what questions you'll want to be putting towards candidates for both the council and Government.
Lastly, do vote, but go prepared. This site over the coming months will try and get election manifestos for all local of the MP and Councillor Candidates, so you can see what they stand for, and if you have any questions how to get in touch.
Comments
Moron
4 Police officers injured? One member of th public. Your pathetic.
Haven't you ever heard of irony Stoopid?
Are you really so stupid Pleb Monkey? Perhaps you've had a a sense of irony bypass?
Pathetic????
[quote=Web Monkey]4 Police officers injured? One member of th public. Your pathetic.[/quote]
Let us think about 9-11 and the London bombings...? That was a form of protest by Muslim extremists. Now that involved the loss of lives...So I would like to think that a protest held against that kind of extremism would be welcomed?
I say, the words " Your Pathetic" should of been thought a little longer about, before posting?
PS... Please don't ' counter post ' about foreign government policy with Afghanistan and Iraq.
The difference
The differenve is that 9-11 and the London bombings were an act of terrorism not a protest.
Everyone has the right to PEACEFULL PROTEST.
I can not condone people pelting the police with bricks, bottles, coins etc and lets face it the EDF will not win public support by doing so. They could argue that they did not do it themselves and that others that joined the march did but racist thugs will join the EDF ranks because that is what they promote.
The muslim religon is a peacfull one but just like all groups it has its extreamists. Do not forget the Christians with the Crusades or the Catholic church during the Spanish Inquisition.
Reply
My first comments weren't about politics, forget that for one second.
My problem was with the first remark. "It was good to see that this went ok without any problems."
Please explain
[quote=Dungwit]It was good to see that this went ok without any problems.[/quote]
Please explain your comments as I am failing to see the irony.
Web Monkey calls in his reinforcements.
ah, you must be a friend of Web Monkey. Welcome sunshine, and I really can't be bothered to explain irony if you don't have the ability to see it yourself.
Dungwit wrote:ah, you must
[quote=Dungwit]ah, you must be a friend of Web Monkey. Welcome sunshine, and I really can't be bothered to explain irony if you don't have the ability to see it yourself.[/quote]
This is a community website In would like to think that we are all friends. However your posts are not in keeping with this type of site. Perhaps they would be more suitable else where.
Community website?
Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.
Dungwit wrote:Ok, so what
[quote=Dungwit]Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.[/quote]
I will explain as you seem only to be able to understand yourself. You started with a post that could be taken in more than one way. When WM challanged it you set about him with personal abuse (not funny) Then you assume that your posts would not be allowed incorrectly,
We are a democracy everyone has a right to free speech. Last how can I know if I am not happy with your posts if I do not read them.
Perhaps the clue to your personality is in your name , in which case perhaps an 02 thief tag may be appropriate.
Steve wrote:Dungwit
[quote=Steve][quote=Dungwit]Ok, so what you are saying is that if someone doesn't agree wholeheartedly and without reservation with you and your little cliche of playmates, then that person should not post at all? That really makes for interesting dialogue, doesn't it. (That was another example of irony)
Grow up, if you are not happy with what I post, don't read it.[/quote]
I will explain as you seem only to be able to understand yourself. You started with a post that could be taken in more than one way. When WM challanged it you set about him with personal abuse (not funny) Then you assume that your posts would not be allowed incorrectly,
We are a democracy everyone has a right to free speech. Last how can I know if I am not happy with your posts if I do not read them.
Perhaps the clue to your personality is in your name , in which case perhaps an 02 thief tag may be appropriate.[/quote]
Gee thanks for explaining, but you as you say yourself, the original post could be taken in more ways than one and was designed to open up dialogue. However, WM seemed to take it in the way that he wanted to, ie, negatively, and he set about me with personal abuse. (Please read his initial "Moron" comment, or did it not fit your agenda to notice that remark?)
If you want to stoop to personal abuse yourself (02 thief tag?), then maybe it's you who should find another forum to post on. So run along little man and get the pat on the head that you crave from your WM friend.
Anyway, how did you feel the protest march went. You never did say. (Perhaps you need time to ask WM what your thoughts are on this matter.
Idiots
Protesting about muslim extreamists is pointless. As it is the sort of reaction the extreamists want as it just stirs up more hatered and predudice. But the EDF are extreamists themselves.
However the goverment have not helped the situation by allowing immigration at such a large scale.
I am not a racist but I do belive that we have now been to soft with immigration.
Steve wrote:Protesting about
[quote=Steve]Protesting about muslim extreamists is pointless. As it is the sort of reaction the extreamists want as it just stirs up more hatered and predudice. But the EDF are extreamists themselves.
However the goverment have not helped the situation by allowing immigration at such a large scale.
I am not a racist but I do belive that we have now been to soft with immigration.[/quote]
Well if there are no protests, how can the Government be made aware of the unrest of the population? How can we know that the EDL is an extremist group as we all know that the Government portray any group that disagree with their policies as extremist or facist, or communist etc. The press will report them as such as it helps to sell newspapers and the Press moguls hols a vested interest in retaining the status quo.
I too am not a racist, but when a white working class man feels discriminated against in his own country, maybe it's time to voice our concerns to those that run this country.
Consider how the Government have ensured that business' set up employment law to ensure that there is a quota of ethnic minorities when selecting staff, regardless of qualification and thereby exempting white workers, consider how the police treat white protestors with batons and strong armed tactics and compare that with the kid glove treatment that protesting muslims get when storming the Dutch Embassy in London, and consider how the council virtually gifted council owned land to muslims to build a mosque when we have delapidated schools and hospitals in the City.
As a matter of interest, I wonder what the white/muslim ratio of employees make up the workforces in Muslim owned businesses.
Perhaps it's not unreasonable that these protests will become more and more commonplace, the people of Britain can only stand so much provocation.
Blame culture
It appears that you are looking to blame any non Anglo Saxon for the woes of this country. If I were you I would look no further than the government of Nu Lairbour. They really should have listened to Enoch Powell all those years ago. Any way take a look at these two links they seem pretty un biased.
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
Thought this was funny
How not to buy bleach see link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZVfyQyu9RY
Comment
I saw this comment and thought it quite whitty , did edit it for profanities though.
Its all a bit Monty Python.
The EDL protesting against Islamic extremists (ie, fascists).
The EDL protesting a government immigration policy (ie, cultural fascism).
The UAF counter protesting against EDL (alledged fascism/rascism).
Theres a lot of Fascists knocking about aint there? Whats going on here, its like a dust up in a Munich beer hall
Dungwit wrote:It was good to
[quote=Dungwit]It was good to see that this went ok without any problems.[/quote]
No Problems I think people including members of the public were hurt that I think is a problem don't you, you have the right to have your say we all do but do it the right way ok
No, I'm not looking to blame
No, I'm not looking to blame non Anglo Saxons for the woes of the country. I'm saying that due to lthe Governments policies for the last 30 years, we find ourselves in a position where the white Anglo Saxon population is frightened to speak out against what they feel is unacceptable in case they are labelled racist or deemed to have an intolerant attitude towards other faiths.
This is not the case in the overwhelming majority of cases, but Muslims in particular use these policies to advance their own agendas at the expense of others.
As far as mrhorace's comment is concerned, I'm at a loss to understand what he means. Is that even English?
Doing things the right way
I will agree with Steve and Web Monkey when they say that the first comment was a little out of place given that there were things that went wrong at the protest. However, I have to agree with Dungwit when it comes to how the general British population are being treated compared to minority groups. We must take into consideration that many of these people who we call foreigners are actually fully fledged British citizens, they were born here, educated here etc..
As mrhorace wrote "do it the right way", many people have tried this over the years but we have a government who think more of Europe than that of it's own people, that is of cause unless you are a Banker!!!!
Anyway, I think that if Dungwit would have wrote the reply to Steves comment, titled "Steve wrote:Protesting About" as his first comment things would have gone a lot better. Anyway, I will get off my soap box now.
Surely the simple answer is that in this country we need total equality and this government does not appear be giving us that. However, would any other potential leading party do a better job on this complex policy?
Within this area we live in a diverse cultural society and I have no problems talking to anyone, no matter what his/her colour or race. We need to stop further immigration at the rate it was happening at but also work with those people who live here already, that goes for everyone, Christian, Muslim, Jew, Hindu or other. If we fail to do so what kind of society are we going to leave for our children?
back up
What got my back up in dungtwits first post was his unironic glorifying of yesterdays march.
A march in which 4 officers and 1 member of the public were injured. Numerous business and residential homes and cars were damaged. 17 arrests made (am I right in thinking they were all edl?)
When challenged dw feigned moral outrage, pretending I'd got the wrong end of the stick, which the more he posted the more it became apparent I'd not.
Rich, maybe dw should ask you to run through his postings first, as you expressed and backed up your views. And like him believe the policy and levels of imigration are far to excessive. My view is our natural food and energy resources cannot meet this demand over the next few decades.
And don't be fooled if you think the march was against extremist Muslims. Why target normacot mosque? why try and break through to cobridge? Why hurl abuse at stokies.
As Steve said (I'm following you now Steve) head over to pitsnpots for the live reporting and summaries .
It's good that dw did post like he told me it promotes debate. There are two big elections coming up, local and national.
It's time for everyone to exercise their right to vote. But don't leave it to the polling both, to decide your politics. Time to read up.
Horace - made sense to qme.
Agree
I totally agree that injuries and damage to property is totally unacceptable. However, from the two articles linked within this topic it would seem that most of the trouble was caused by people not directly linked to the protest. These people should obviously be dealt with to the greatest extent that the law permits, this sort of behaviour should never be tolerated.
It is a shame that yet again a few people spoil it for the majority. I for one have no problem in anyone having peaceful demonstrations. However, as indicated in the articles, I am sure that the organisers of this event will now have to trouble convincing any other City to allow them to demonstrate.
Web Monkey wrote:What got my
[quote=Web Monkey]What got my back up in dungtwits first post was his unironic glorifying of yesterdays march.
A march in which 4 officers and 1 member of the public were injured. Numerous business and residential homes and cars were damaged. 17 arrests made (am I right in thinking they were all edl?)
When challenged dw feigned moral outrage, pretending I'd got the wrong end of the stick, which the more he posted the more it became apparent I'd not.
Rich, maybe dw should ask you to run through his postings first, as you expressed and backed up your views. And like him believe the policy and levels of imigration are far to excessive. My view is our natural food and energy resources cannot meet this demand over the next few decades.
And don't be fooled if you think the march was against extremist Muslims. Why target normacot mosque? why try and break through to cobridge? Why hurl abuse at stokies.
As Steve said (I'm following you now Steve) head over to pitsnpots for the live reporting and summaries .
It's good that dw did post like he told me it promotes debate. There are two big elections coming up, local and national.
It's time for everyone to exercise their right to vote. But don't leave it to the polling both, to decide your politics. Time to read up.
Horace - made sense to qme.[/quote]
Web Monkey, you never cease to amaze. Are you simple, gullible or naive? Maybe all three?
Firstly, I don't glorify the march at all. I have said that it's a sign of things to come if their isn't a major shift in the Governments policies. Not just immigration, but equality. It has been acknowledged by certain Government figures, that the white working class have been overlooked over a good number of years.
A question. Why was the UAF allowed to countermarch at the same venue? They could easily have protested on a nother day. Four officers injured? Two resumed their duties immediately, the other returned to duty after treatment and the last one treated for minor injuries. Whilst I agree, no one should have to be injured or hurt during these protests, it's pretty much a certainty that someone will be hurt particularly when two diagonally opposed groups are allowed to march at the same time.
Numerous cars and homes? Can you quantify that? Any damage is not acceptable, but you are making out it's like Dresden after the Blitz. (I mean the Dresden in Germany before you ask)
Now, if you had the inclination to think for yourself, instead of sponging up all the Newspaper and media soundbites, you might just come to a conclusion of your own. Think about it, go on, I know you can.
The press will report to sell newspapers. Sensationalism sells, simples. The Police, who exist to serve the Government, not the public, will have their agenda set by the Government. Therefore, it serves them well to portray any dissenting voices as rabble rousers, bigoted, racist etc. Maybe it was in their interest to let a countermarch go ahead in order to inflame the situation.
By the way, if you want to talk about bigoted views, have a look at the Muslim attitude to women, homosexuals, non believers, their own caste systems, forced marriages etc.
Oh, and "natural food and energy resources?"
Ping ponging all over the place
First you start with a flippent remark, to get everyone but yourself talking (as you told me) about what they think.
Your right I didn't see what was going with my own eyes. I watched it unfold on twitter
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/live
Read Pits n Pots, as they were following the day in real time. The Sentinel posted what was a summary of the Police press release at the end of the day, late on Saturday night, and was so poorly written, I couldn't form any opinion based on their report.
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-photo-gallery
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-stoke-tren...
Watched a couple of videos
Keep watching: about 20 seconds in. So no, it wasn't a good day up hanley was it. EDL need to loose the hard core element before people even begin to listen to them, and not think of them as just thugs.
Before it all kicked off, this old couple went through the massed rally as though nothing was untoward. One video on You Tube showed the lack of respect from some youths as they went by.
I then formed my own opinion, and not one I'm told to form. I still have the right to think and express my views?
http://pitsnpots.co.uk/news/2010/01/edl-uaf-demo-counter-demo-photo-gallery
And video form EDL supporters/members making their way over the forest park up towards cobdrige lights.
If you've got sensitive ears, turn your sound down. But if you do you'll miss the BNP chants.
Still think this is what the march was about? That it turned nasty? And your sure your happy with that?
Freedom of Speech
While your comment did not offend me Dungwit or antagonize me, i think that if it had been a little better presented i am sure (well i hope) you may not have caught such a fish......
Yes you do raise some valid points as well as web monkey does, maybe you are both closer in your views in reality than you both think......
Gordy
Web Monkey misses the point .......................again!
WM, here's the point. The EDL march was a message to the Government. It is a shout from the bullied and browbeaten public that enough is enough. We all want an equal society but that means for EVERYBODY, including the white working class.
How can it be healthy to surpress geniune outrage at discrimination?
The real problem is that the country is now attacking the right to free speech. But right is right and wrong is wrong, and I see no reason for the EDL to have their views surpressed.
I used to work with a Pakistani colleague and during our discussions, he said that he would never have a white girlfriend as they have loose morals and dress inappropriately. I told him I thought he was being racist as not all white women were like this. He replied, "I can't be racist, I'm Asian". (This may give you a clue about what the Muslim community really think about us)
Now, if I said the same thing about a Muslim woman, I would automatically castigated as a racist, and rightly so.
The point is, the Government, police, civil service, council, all bend over backwards in order not to offend Muslims, but in doing so they discriminate against others. This is what the EDL, BNP etc are protesting about.
The other point I would like to close on is the difference in attitude shown by the police when dealing with the EDL faction and the counter protest march. Take a look at the video evidence. At the counter protest march the police couldn't have looked friendlier if they had dressed as telly tubbies. Contrast that with the greeting the police gave to the EDL.
Missed your point as you've only just stated it.
Dungwit, I only missed your point because you never stated it until just.
Can I just add, that out of all of this the best line of the thread has be awarded to you.
"At the counter protest march the police couldn't have looked friendlier if they had dressed as telly tubbies."
So there you have it. I think myself and Dungwit have gone on long enough about this, you've got enough view points now to start thinking about the elections later this year, and also what questions you'll want to be putting towards candidates for both the council and Government.
Lastly, do vote, but go prepared. This site over the coming months will try and get election manifestos for all local of the MP and Councillor Candidates, so you can see what they stand for, and if you have any questions how to get in touch.
Not a march
According to the police, this was not a march, but an assembly, that is the reason it was allowed to go ahead